Hello, I'm Kalek.  I'm beginning this thread because I am absolutely worried about the future of DDR.  First, let me tell you a small amount about the experience that I've had in the past with DDR.  I began playing DDR at Christmas of 2003.  As of winter or spring of 2005, I began playing In The Groove.  I feel that in this time, I have attained quite an extensive knowledge of both.  I should also mention at this point that I have also been seriously playing Pump It Up for a little over a year.  I continue to play all three for different reasons at different times.  They're all unique in their own way and I hope it continues to stay that way.

I began playing DDR because it was fun.  That's all there is to it.  For once, I found a game that I absolutely loved and I had a drive to get good at it.  Not just good like get As on standard [difficult] songs, I mean like AAA harder heavy [expert] songs.  To this day, the game that I fell in love with is still very fun.  I began playing In The Groove because everyone else seemed to be moving to it at the time and because at the time I felt DDR was kind of easy.

So, I jumped on the ITG bandwagon.  I still played the game that originally made me enjoy the entire dance game genre quite a bit, but ITG was my main focus.  At some point my focus shifted more toward DDR and it has stayed there.  Originally it was because ITG2 came out and the closest machine was an hour and a half away, while the closest DDR was 10 minutes away.  I still got ITG once a month, but there was no real way to get good at it.  In 2006, ITG2 finally hit an arcade near me (actually it's about the same distance as the DDR machines).  After playing it extensively, I quickly found out that ITG songs were boring or just plain bad, and the step charts are were just boring 16th note runs and, they were more stamina draining than hard.

Around the time that this new machine showed up, DDR SuperNOVA also came out.  The local Gameworks had a brand new machine within a week or two of its release.  I was so hyped up over SuperNOVA that I didn't notice at first how bad it was.  Now that SuperNOVA has been around a while, I've realized that none of the step charts are particularly memorable, the interface is ugly, and in general the new licenses weren't particularly good.  I dealt with it, but also continued to play and enjoy Extreme.  Here in Ohio, SuperNOVA didn't catch on as much as other places and a lot of places kept Extreme.  Everyone to this day still continues to play Extreme the majority of the time because it is definitely the better game.

Fast forward to the SuperNOVA2 location test.  I didn't get to go to the location test (although that's not to say I didn't try), but I knew four people that DID go.  I got first-hand information about the location test from people like ranatalus and drano.  I was told (as everyone else eventually) that SuperNOVA2 was definitely going to have E-Amusement, just about everything was on sync, and the song list was significantly better than SuperNOVA's song list (mostly because of "Why not", but a lot of it is good).  Overall, it was a huge improvement and it seemed like DDR was finally going to be fun again, like the days of DDR Extreme.  At the time, I couldn't possibly see how SN2 could come out any later than September or October.  Well, I was wrong.  Everyone was in the dark about SN2 up until December, when rumors started cropping up that SN2 was finally coming.  Betson confirmed this and Ryan Cravens made his rounds to message boards like DDRFreak confirming that SN2 was coming.

I can remember very clearly someone made a post that said only "E-Amusement in the US!"  Immediately, Ryan came back and posted that E-Amusement was not happening, which put the entire community on edge.  Some ended up protesting SN2 because of the lack of E-Amusement, some didn't.  All of Ohio did.  We didn't get an SN2 machine in the state until probably two or three weeks ago.  I have played SN2 quite a bit, both with and without E-Amusement.  I just had to drive 4+ hours [or 6+ for SN2 with E-Amusement] at the time to go play it.  I think the game is a very very large improvement over SN1.  However, E-Amusement makes the game amazing and totally worth the six hours that we had to drive to play it.  E-Amusement made the already fun SN2 absolutely amazing, and not just because of the unlocks.  Getting my Enjoy Levels up and unlocking new characters gave me more reason to play the game than just getting new scores.

My biggest problem with SuperNOVA2 was that the boss songs were much more difficult than they should have been, and for the wrong reasons.  NGO has an absolutely terrible oni chart that imitates one of the worst of ITG.  Paranoia Hades oni has that crazy slow down and 8th runs going into jumps.  Trip Machine Phoenix wasn't that bad, but I can remember a few weird jumps here and there that made me go, "what?".  Pluto oni I don't have much to complain about, but Pluto Relinquish oni's ending is absolutely horrible and I would never like to experience that on feet.  I think that if Pluto Relinquish had the heavy step chart with the standard ending, it'd be absolutely amazing and extremely fun.

I'm not saying that I don't like these charts because I can't do them.  In fact, I don't think i'd have any problems passing or even AAing most of them, with the exception of Pluto Relinquish oni.  Now, remember when I said that I began playing DDR because it was fun?  Yeah, that's still why I play it.  These charts are NOT fun and I get absolutely no excitement from playing them.  The same can be said for things like HDV oni and FELM oni.  If I wanted to play ******it hard songs, I'd go play keyboard charts on ITG.  Sometimes I do get that urge, and that's when I go play ITG, but the vast majority of the time I'm looking for the actual fun of playing the game rather than the satisfaction of beating a difficult song that was absolute hell to get through.

Just recently, as most or all of you know, DDR X arcade was announced.  There's a new cabinet with lots of lights and a widescreen monitor.  There are new features like 'more intense' step charts, and 'shock arrows' where you can't stand on a panel while the arrow passes the targets.  I'll be honest, it looks absolutely terrible.

When the new cabinet was talked about, I was uneasy, but still hopeful.  When I heard about the widescreen monitor, I became significantly more uneasy, but I just hoped that Konami knew to set a lag offset like IIDX DJTroopers and knew to set the aspect ratio correctly.  However, from the recent pictures that I've seen, those lights are going to be extraordinarily distracting.  I don't personally find DDR/ITG lights distracting, but I know plenty who do, and if Konami is making a cabinet that will distract me away from gameplay, think of those people who are already distracted by the standard cabinets.  Honestly, I'm completely and utterly content with the old (Extreme and before cabinet) with a 4:3 flat screen CRT monitor like the one that comes with the Betson cabinets.  Not only that, but I would prefer it significantly over the new style cabinet, just like I prefer Pump GX cabinets over Pump FX cabinets.  If Konami really is set on using the new cabinets, please leave the option for an old style cabinet.  If they aren't sure, I think a ton of people would love to have the old style cabinet back.

About the new gameplay features being announced, specifically "shock arrows" and "more intense step charts", I am appalled.  I did not ever expect Konami to sink this low, to include mines (shock arrows) in their game.  DDR is becoming In The Groove, and I don't like it.  Like I mentioned before, I've played ITG quite a bit, and it isn't fun like DDR is fun.  It hurts me to see the game that I love going downhill so quickly.  Every person that either I or someone else has mentioned these features to has groaned and I don't know of anyone who I still see playing DDR frequently getting excited over this mix with these features.

I love DDR Extreme a lot.  I'd love to see more like it.  I'd maybe venture to say that DDR Extreme arcade is my favorite game ever.  Whatever happened to "We're Starting Over!" and "DanceDanceRevolution Generation Next!"?  DDR Extreme isn't perfect, but it's pretty **** close, and taking this formula that worked so well and becoming more and more like ITG with each iteration of DDR isn't going to help your series.  Konami is driving away DDR's biggest fans, and they're trying to replace them with the ITG players that aren't ever going back to DDR.

I guess my point with this entire post is that DDR should NOT become ITG.  I know that if it does, I personally will continue to play DDR Extreme, but I doubt that me or anyone I know who takes DDR seriously will continue to play anything new.  If you think I'm alone in my opinion, go to http://oddr.net and find out about a large, tight knit community that is completely centered around DDR and dance games and I can pretty much guarantee that everyone there will almost unanimously agree with my opinion of DDR X.  In fact, I'm sitting in a room full of DDR players (six of them specifically) and no one here actually likes the new features of DDR X.  One person said, and I quote, "Mines are the worst idea ever for DDR."  Another (someone who went to the SN2 location test) said "I want to play DDR, not IN THE GROOVE."

Please listen and hear me out on this.  Thanks for reading.

Dudes take it easy.... this is the same thing with the pump long arrow, also that the new features in the new DDR X is hiidding for now, so stop speculated. In the worst escenario the game is done and we can't do anything at least to the next mix, so stop speculated and wait hear the officaly news about this game, Konami give us innovation and new cabinet, i'm so glad about this, i don't feel DDR X = Other Dancing Game.... Wait for the location test please.

Expecting Konami to not take the widescreen into consideration really is just pushing it a little too far.

I completely and totally agree with Kalek.  It seems like, with each iteration of the series, DDR is turning more and more into In The Groove.  With SuperNOVA, they introduced some pretty ridiculous charts for Boss songs.  with SuperNOVA 2, they added Marvelous timing into regular gameplay.  With DDR X, they're adding "Shock Arrows" and "Intensified steps".  Please don't do this to us.  I have been playing DDR since the Fall or Winter of 2002.  DDR Extreme (Arcade) IS my favorite game and has been for a long time.  A friend and I even pooled our money together recently to purchase our own DDR Arcade machine just so that we could play whenever we want.  Don't get me wrong, I won't refuse to play SuperNOVA 1 or 2... Extreme is just so much better.

Think of it like this.  In the United States, DDR started becoming popular around 2000 or 2001.  Extreme came out in 2002.  From 2002 until 2006 there were NO new mixes at all.  In that 4 year span, DDR Extreme had been played to death.  People were just dying for something new.  In The Groove came out and people started flocking to it.  Was In The Groove a good game necessarily?  Not really, as far as I'm concerned.  It was just something new and more difficult.  If DDR mixes had still been coming out regularly, through that 4 year period, do you think Roxor would have had a prayer of harvesting such a fan base? Not at all.

I've been looking forward to 2008 ever since SuperNOVA came out because I had this feeling that Konami would make a special 10th anniversary mix.  Instead of ruining the game on it's 10th anniversary, why not take the game back to it's roots?  Take the game back to what made it so amazing and fun originally?  I'm not saying "Remove hard charts, make them all easy, get rid of freezes, never release a new feature" blah blah blah.  I'm saying, come out with your own new features.  Don't come out with a feature just because In The Groove had it.  You guys are, obviously, incredibly creative to have given us the great plethora of Mixes we've seen since 1998.  Why not use that creativity to keep DDR alive rather than push every loyal fan away.

I understand that Extreme was important to a lot of people in the competitive DDR Community, but people just have to let it go already. Let the game evolve, let the developers experiment with things. If they can implement mines well and keep the basic fun of the game intact, then where's the harm? The new charts are "garbage" only to those who have kept playing the same three songs over and over and aren't open to new things. Yes, I know we've all had a long argument over this in the last thread about difficulty, but there's just so much impatience and nostalgia running around that the community is giving the developers no room for creativity and experimentation.

It's so bad that if you took Extreme AC's interface in its entirety and changed it into a different color, improved framerate a little bit but kept some of the off-synch charts intact, added a few dozen songs and called it Extreme2 there'd still be an uproar. The more vocal of the community, not necessarily the majority, just want to play Extreme. 

I say let them. Keep going with the development of X and experiment with things, see how they work, take the good and improve the bad. The game WILL NOT GET BETTER if this doesn't happen. I guarantee you that's what the majority of players want, the game to get better. The new difficult charts were an okay start (take the criticisms and learn from it, improve on it), and the shock arrows, even though obviously borrowed from ITG, are a good direction, but only if they are implemented right as Freezes were back during MAX. Improving the pad quality and sound system of Dedicabs is also a great idea. The widescreen is also pretty cool just as long as lag doesn't effect the gameplay (which, with technology from recent IIDX/Pop'n/GFDM PS2 games, shouldn't be an issue). Running the game with BemaniPC will bring DDR back to the level it once was.

USB with e-Amuse. This is the best decision that could have ever been made. Kudos to that. :)

You, the developers, are about to be hit with dozens of forum pages of whining fanboys begging for Extreme, most of them by Arch0wl and hordes from BemaniStyle. That's not going to happen even though they won't admit to it. There's a giant ego complex involved with the community; the slightest touch to their beloved green interface, choppy FPS and 573 jokes is like genocide to them. If they're not going to be constructive with their criticisms and post nothing but insults to your hard work then ignore them. They'll threaten to never play DDR again or buy another Konami product but we all know that they're addicted to the game and their egos.

I, for one, am exited for X. I hope to be there for the testing and to try the machine out for myself, because I know I will enjoy it. I know this will be the mix that truly gets DDR back on track. Please keep working hard on this, and learn from the CONSTRUCTIVE criticism that is bound to happen. 

Hey guys, let's completely judge a game with 0 songs confirmed for it, 0 stepcharts seen from it, practically no interface seen of it, and four blurry cell phone camera pictures of a dedicab that quite frankly, looks better than any DDR cabinet that's been officially released. 

Shock Arrows are in no way confirmed for 'normal' stepcharts. If anything, all signs point to them being in a seperate mode or as an optional modifier. Hell, the information about Shock Arrows came from a third party anyways.

So hey, here's an idea. Let's see what new ideas Konami put into DDR X and wait to see a full songlist, and THEN we can complain about it. 

If you think I'm alone in my opinion, go to http://oddr.net and find out about a large, tight knit community that is completely centered around DDR and dance games and I can pretty much guarantee that everyone there will almost unanimously agree with my opinion of DDR X.

Hi, I'm actually excited to see the new setup, sorry.

"Expecting Konami to not take the widescreen into consideration really is just pushing it a little too far."

I never said I expected it, I said I would like it better.

 "The new charts are "garbage" only to those who have kept playing the same three songs over and over and aren't open to new things."

can you honestly say you had fun after playing Pluto Relinquish Oni or NGO Oni?

"It's so bad that if you took Extreme AC's interface in its entirety and changed it into a different color, improved framerate a little bit but kept some of the off-synch charts intact, added a few dozen songs and called it Extreme2 there'd still be an uproar. The more vocal of the community, not necessarily the majority, just want to play Extreme."

I know of plenty of people that would be fine with that.  And if the more vocal of the community want to play Extreme, why is DDR becoming In The Groove?  Read these boards.  Read AIJ.  Read BMS.  The more vocal in the community want ITG for their DDR and I'm speaking for myself and the people around me that I know would never want that.

 "I guarantee you that's what the majority of players want, the game to get better."

Yes, I can agree with that.  But, making harder, gimmicky charts that no one wants to play isn't going to make a game better.

"and the shock arrows, even though obviously borrowed from ITG, are a good direction, but only if they are implemented right as Freezes were back during MAX."

 Do you know of any one who thinks that mines are actually a good idea rather than a huge nuisance?

"Improving the pad quality and sound system of Dedicabs is also a great idea."

I never said it wasn't.  But, one can improve those things without making an entirely new cabinet that is both distracting and looks like a crazy child of the Pump FX, IIDX, and an ITG2 dedicated cabinet.

"Running the game with BemaniPC will bring DDR back to the level it once was."

I'm just wondering, how will BemaniPC make that much of a difference in syncing arrows to music?  Extreme ran on a glorified PS1 and it didn't look that bad.  I don't mind BemaniPC, i'm just wondering.  All the home versions run on a PS2 and look and feel fine.  Why would BemaniPC enable Konami to make DDR better anymore than a PS2 (aside from the obvious being able to release DDR in Europe again)?

"USB with e-Amuse. This is the best decision that could have ever been made. Kudos to that. :)"

I didn't say everything about the new cabinet was bad.

"Hi, I'm actually excited to see the new setup, sorry."

I said 'almost' :P.  And, you can't tell me that you actually want mines in DDR, which honestly is the biggest thing that prompted me to start this.

can you honestly say you had fun after playing Pluto Relinquish Oni or NGO Oni?

Yes, every DDR game has had it's bad charts. Look at Angelus, Blind Justice, CaptivAte ~Chikai~, Fire, Stars (Retuned by HAL), Saturn, Trust -DanceDanceRevolution Mix-, MARS WAR 3, and others. Those are all great charts, but you NEVER hear about them, because everyone wants to focus on DEGRS. Seriously, I actually remember looking on AIJ in the SN2 thread, where they posted about 5 pages on DEGRS and how much it sucked and how much SN2 sucked. There was one lone poster who was posting YouTube links to the other stepcharts and was like "Guys, not all of SN2 is like that...". But they continued whining, though I did see one person quote one of his videos and be like 'whoa, that stepchart is pretty good lol'.

P.S.

"Shock Arrows are in no way confirmed for 'normal' stepcharts. If anything, all signs point to them being in a seperate mode or as an optional modifier. Hell, the information about Shock Arrows came from a third party anyways."

Why do I have to be an outcast ;_;

Well, don't get me wrong, I'm still gonna go to the test location and give my thoughts on the game once I play it.

I'm just saying that from all the information that has come out about the game, I personally, and many others aren't particularly excited about this.

I'm just saying that from all the information that has come out about the game, I personally, and many others aren't particularly excited about this.

So, what exactly do you expect a Konami employee to think when s/he reads this thread? That from the whole 10 screenshots they released, you're not excited by it, and so they should drop everything and completely trash the game and start over?

 I mean, I get where you're coming from. I don't want mines in DDR (at least in the context of being in normal stepcharts), but as I said, we can't even confirm where they'll be used in the game. I'm laying my hope that they're being used in a seperate mode or something, and if they're not, I'm gonna give as much feedback as I can to get them removed. But Konami won't give a crap about our opinions until they actually release a significant amount of information.

Honestly, I'm excited about DDR X. I know some in the community are and some aren't, which just shows how much trouble Konami has with pinpointing player opinion because of the vast variety of opinions out there. But I mean, USB support for edits, good edits actually being published with e-amuse, new cabs with (seemingly) improved speakers and pads? Konami gets credit from me for those things alone.

I have to admit that I was expecting hands before mines, but I'm happy by principle that we're finally getting a new arrow type. The Shock arrow descr iption still seems ambiguous to me from the translations I've read, so I'll mention (again, haha) that it might follow the past DDR precedent and only activate when tapped. But yes, hopefully they will be used tastefully and the interface will show (say, on the groove radar) which songs have them. If they were used in regular mode, I imagine there would be a Shocks Off like with freezes, anyway.

At any rate, I've seen ITG charts with mines that were also fun. Then again, I like Zodiac and Pick Me Up & Tango. With arcade edits, there will be more exposure (at least in Japan where there's e-amuse) to community steps.

And I can understand being worried about boss charts after SN2's "needs more jumps" theme and SN1's "let's max the chaos with yellow-arrow syndrome".

"So, what exactly do you expect a Konami employee to think when s/he reads this thread? That from the whole 10 screenshots they released, you're not excited by it, and so they should drop everything and completely trash the game and start over?"

I'm not sure if I expect them to think anything.  I don't know how Konami works or how set they are on making the game this way.  I'm giving my opinion in hopes that they have any chance of listening to me.

 "If they were used in regular mode, I imagine there would be a Shocks Off like with freezes, anyway."

Yeah, I'm sure there will be a shocks off feature, but like freezes off in all DDRs and mines off in ITG, the scores WON'T COUNT.  Getting good scores is half the fun for me in this game, and if my scores aren't going to count, it takes out a lot of the fun.

I don't know how Konami works or how set they are on making the game this way

Noone even knows 'what way' Konami is making this game yet. 

Well it could be the other way, too. You can turn on Jumps Off 1 and still get full points without needing to jump; it's an easy way to AAA NGO Oni, haha. (I admit I haven't tested this at the arcade yet, but I'd expect it to work.)

Holy Guacamole was another cool mine chart. 

"Noone even knows 'what way' Konami is making this game yet. "

if the game ends up being good rather than being the ITG that I was expecting when writing the post, this thread has done its job

I'm trying to avoid DDR becoming bad before it's too late.  Usually by the time they actually announce gameplay details, the game has already been completed for the most part and it would not be very time-effective to go back and change everything about it when Konami realizes that it may not be what people want.

Hey guys, let's completely judge a game with 0 songs confirmed for it, 0 stepcharts seen from it, practically no interface seen of it, and four blurry cell phone camera pictures of a dedicab that quite frankly, looks better than any DDR cabinet that's been officially released.

This.

This.

And this again. Everyone's getting into a huge snarl over a game for which they have almost no information. KONAMI is trying something new to keep the series interesting, and you have no idea how it will be implemented.

Just like Pie's been saying, sure you can say you honestly didn't have fun with NGO Challenge, but can you honestly say you didn't have fun with the majority of the other charts?

Your 'biggest problem' with SuperNOVA2 is five songs out of so many more. If that's the game's most significant flaw, then you know what, it's a pretty good game. 

"Hey guys, let's completely judge a game with 0 songs confirmed for it, 0 stepcharts seen from it, practically no interface seen of it, and four blurry cell phone camera pictures of a dedicab that quite frankly, looks better than any DDR cabinet that's been officially released.

This."

That's very subjective.  I've heard very mixed opinions on the cabinet from "it looks like complete ***" to "I'm very excited to play on it", however most (at least from the people that I know and play DDR with irl) lean toward the "it looks like complete ***" comment.

"Just like Pie's been saying, sure you can say you honestly didn't have fun with NGO Challenge, but can you honestly say you didn't have fun with the majority of the other charts?

Your 'biggest problem' with SuperNOVA2 is five songs out of so many more. If that's the game's most significant flaw, then you know what, it's a pretty good game. "

Yes, but when the six songs with horribly unfun stepcharts are arguably the most important songs in the game, I'm a little more annoyed.  Max 300 is fun.  Unlimited is fun.  Legend of Max is fun.  At least around here, they're the most played songs in tournaments also.  If the trend continues, I feel like as a competitive DDR player that I'm obligated to learn these new charts and get good at them if I want to do well in a tournament.

And yes, while the new charts in SN2 are more fun than anything in SN1, I can still feel the game becoming ITG.  Random 16th runs in the middle of Blind Justice that don't go with the rest of the chart are annoying.  CaptivAte becoming difficult out of nowhere at the end isn't fun.  Angelus is broken as **** and I don't think the triplet bug is very fun (and don't give me **** about how the triplet bug is fixed in SN2.  While I agree with that for the most part, Angelus is still broken).  Personally, I didn't like Fire when I played it in Naperville when it was first unlocked, but I don't know the chart well enough to give any reason.

That's very subjective.  I've heard very mixed opinions on the cabinet from "it looks like complete ***" to "I'm very excited to play on it", however most (at least from the people that I know and play DDR with irl) lean toward the "it looks like complete ***" comment.

Well, check on Zenius,DDRFreak,DDR:UK, BemaniStyle, and even AIJ. The majority opinion from what I've seen is that the cabinet looks nice and is a refreshing change. But hey, by all means let's stick with the old cabinets. Heaven forbid Konami do something new.

But even so, we have FOUR BLURRY pictures of it. Can we actually play on things before we tell Konami how crappy they are? 

Angelus is off? That's the first I'm hearing off it, and I've probably played it about 100 times. It goes perfectly with the music and I have no trouble getting AAAs on it.CaptivAte's ending goes with the music. The ending part is one of the funnest charts that DDR has.

 "Well, check on Zenius,DDRFreak,DDR:UK, BemaniStyle, and even AIJ. The majority opinion from what I've seen is that the cabinet looks nice and is a refreshing change. But hey, by all means let's stick with the old cabinets. Heaven forbid Konami do something new."

I'm not in the least bit against Konami doing something new.  But, when it ****ing sucks, I'm going to make every effort I can to let Konami know that it ****ing sucks and they should do something different.

"But even so, we have FOUR BLURRY pictures of it. Can we actually play on things before we tell Konami how crappy they are?"

Did you see how bright the lights were?  Can you imagine how distracting they would be?

"Angelus is off? That's the first I'm hearing off it, and I've probably played it about 100 times. It goes perfectly with the music and I have no trouble getting AAAs on it.CaptivAte's ending goes with the music. The ending part is one of the funnest charts that DDR has."

You're talking about the arcade?

My friend Goemon who has AAA'd all of Extreme save for 300, Unlimited, PSM, and PSMO hates playing it because it's so broken.  He would LOVE the chart if it wasn't broken, but he says that he CAN'T STAND IT because of how off it is.  He has more greats on it than each of the songs that he has left on Extreme because he doesn't want to play it.

It was a cellphone camera. It was probably just some kind of glare, once again...please PLAY it before you actually judge it. Konami is not going to be impressed when you're saying it "****ing sucks" without even playing it. Hell, it's FOUR BLURRY CELLPHONE CAMERA PICTURES. If YOU were Konami, would you listen to that opinion? I know I sure wouldn't.

Also, do you guys know about the slowdowns in Angelus? They're very slight, but they're enough to make you get lots of greats if you don't know where they are. Otherwise, I don't know what the problem is. I'd pop in SN2 right now, but I'm playing another game atm, but I've played Angelus enough anyways. 

"It was a cellphone camera. It was probably just some kind of glare, once again...please PLAY it before you actually judge it. Konami is not going to be impressed when you're saying it "****ing sucks" without even playing it. Hell, it's FOUR BLURRY CELLPHONE CAMERA PICTURES. If YOU were Konami, would you listen to that opinion? I know I sure wouldn't."

It's still a camera!  I'm still allowed to form an opinion!  That's like saying if I have a picture of a pile of **** on my cell phone, I'm not allowed to say it's gross until I smell it.

"Also, do you guys know about the slowdowns in Angelus? They're very slight, but they're enough to make you get lots of greats if you don't know where they are."

Yes, I'm very aware of the slow downs in Angelus.

"Otherwise, I don't know what the problem is. I just played it on Stepmania with 0.5x and the arrows synched with the music (It was the official stepchart, of course)."

wait, what was that?

"I just played it on Stepmania"

Oh, right.  StepMania simfiles aren't always accurate.

It's still a camera!  I'm still allowed to form an opinion!  That's like saying if I have a picture of a pile of **** on my cell phone, I'm not allowed to say it's gross until I smell it

Dude, I'm trying to help you. If you spent months making a game, trying to please the fans who have about 100 different opinion, and then someone posts a whole topic on how much your game sucks, based on almost nothing, and their whole complaint comes down to "it ****ing sucks", would YOU listen to that person? 

Konami will release surveys once the Location tests start (even for people who didn't go to the location test), so I think your opinions would better be stated there, once Konami knows you actually have information.

It still boggles my mind as to how people can still only play Extreme after so many years.  Sure it was a fun game, but seriously get over it.  Move on with the game (and if you don't want to, then keep playing Extreme and stop bugging other people).  Innovation is what keeps games fresh.  I'm pretty sure if Konami made a game very similar to Extreme more people would complain that it's too similar.

can you honestly say you had fun after playing Pluto Relinquish Oni or NGO Oni?

Wait what?  Since when did every chart have to be "fun"?  I'm going to quote someone who said how I feel about this PERFECTLY:

 "As for difficulty, if you don't like the super-hard challenge songs, don't play them. I dunno what the scene in the west is, but here in Japan, it was very exciting watching all the players try hard to pass the new challenge songs. They made it slightly longer each time, until finally passing, then slowly getting their grades up. It was pretty dam satisfying to finally pass the songs too. I don't think they should make the boss songs easier, but they should have more overall difficulty balance."

I honestly don't understand why more people don't have this mentality.  It's how I still play the game, and it's fun when you have other people around you that feel the same way.  When you were learning how to play, you did it with Extreme 10's (before you knew that they were "good" charts), so you can do it with the more recent 10's.

I know it's a game, and a game is supposed to be fun.  But come on.  At least try on something that's different. There's ways around those tough parts in the boss songs.  For Relinquish, you can either heel-toe the ending or just flat out go for it.  It's very fast, but I'll feel a great sense of accomplishment once I pass it.  For Paranoia Hades, in the beginning you'll have to re-position yourself for those 8th notes into jumps.  You can alternate your feet on the jackhammers in the middle.  You can try to get around those pesky ending jumps (the ones in the middle of the stream) by treating the jump like a 32nd note rhythm (like people do on Tell expert in ITG).  As for as NGO Oni goes, I'm one of the few who thinks that the middle jump sequence fits the climax of the song perfectly, and I love it.  I've found a way to easily do that part, and I feel awesome after I get through that part.  So yes, I do have fun playing NGO Oni.  That's not what you wanted to hear, was it?

I have to admit that I was expecting hands before mines, but I'm happy by principle that we're finally getting a new arrow type.

I agree with you 100% here.