I have 4 brand-new SN2 machines in my area.

They've all broken in some way shape or form within their first two weeks of operation. Usually having to deal with sensors.

The SN1 cabinets were poor in comparison to Konami cabinets, but not nearly as bad as this batch of SN2 cabinets. Did Betson skimp further on materials to save themselves even more money this time around?

Our 5th mix is still in wonderful order.

Betson's dropped the ball several times in their short tenure as your NA supplier. I shouldn't have to, and will not go into details as to how because everyone is aware of the reasons (or should be).

Please, either get some equality into Betson's builds vs. Konami's official cabinet builds, or drop Betson as a supplier and stop giving our arcades crap for their dollar.

Do you really feel that giving arcades machines that break down and require maintenance so frequently because of cheap parts, would make them inclined to not only buy e-amuse (if that day ever comes), but to purchase future cabinets/mixes from you for thousands of dollars? You're hurting yourselves long-term by saving money in the short-term.

All you have to do is post /sign. I don't want this to get into another "lol itg pads are better, ddr was always crap, i can't bracketwhore on ddr pads, ddr pads are too low, why is my manhood so small?" argument.

I agree with this very strongly.

So do I.

from what I have heard this has already happened.

two things which pushed Konami out of Betson..

sn2 had problems getting out because betson didnt want to start selling until they got rid of their sn1 machines.

at the sn2 location test in new jersey, betson installed a developmental piece of hardware into the machine which unlocked it completely.

if sn3 ever happens, it won't be with betson involved, though this is just speculation.

 edit; something else which also upsets me with betson is that they never seem to care about their products from konami. i've been to many trade shows and never once has a betson rep asked me how i liked the game.

we need a god **** Konami US arcade division for **** sake.

Huh.  When my arcade's brand-new SN arrived it was broken.  Sensors messed up, game not working until the arcade tech did some work on it.  I thought this was an isolated fluke, but now it looks like it wasn't.

Betson's sensors have been pretty terrible. Companies like Channelbeat and Uniarcade are making quite a bit of money making reliable parts for DDR and other bemani games. It'd be nice if we didn't have to go to overseas countries instead of local suppliers to get parts that we can rely on.

Bacon: I wasn't aware of Konami dropping Betson, that's definitely good news if it's actually news at all.

Was this watercooler chatter? Or have there been posts about it? I haven't read anything about it.

Keep entertaining me on youtube, btw.

If this is true, then things should work out better.

With Betson gone, the next ac machine should be in much better shape.

Not to mention the game itself would be cheaper too. 

But before we all get excited, we should wait and see if this is the case.

What has gone wrong other than sensors? These are VERY easily replaced you know.

TGLMaxX

watercooler chatter from people "in the know".

"What has gone wrong other than sensors? These are VERY easily replaced you know."

Yes, but when a batch of brand new sensors has 20% that don't work properly out of the box that's pretty ridiculous.

While I haven't heard that it is for-sure that Konami is dropping Betson, I definitely have heard that no one with Konami is happy about how they've done things. I still don't know how feasible re-opening the US Arcade Division is going to be, but hopefully they're able to pull some kind of profit. Otherwise, within a year or two we'll be back in the same spot we are now, just with a different company playing the middle-man.

Replaced from someone other than betson......

An investor in a product shouldn't have to bank on the fact that they'll have to buy replacement parts to accompany their order because the thing'll break down in a few weeks, moose.

That's extra money, labour, downtime, stuff that arcades don't exactly want to be incurring from a brand-new multi-thousand dollar purchase with the current state of arcades as it is.

So, even if the sensors CAN be replaced by someone other than Betson, the point is why aren't those better sensors being used in the original product in the first place? Instead of leaving arcade ops out to dry while Betson/Konami runs away with their money.

I'm pretty sure that any arcade op nowadays wants to see their new purchase start turning in revenue like he/she expects it to, instead of having to immediately give it an indeterminable amount of downtime while replacement parts get ordered in. It's very, very poor business practice. One that doesn't usually see repeat customers.

looks like buying a dedicab for SN2 US would be a really bad idea, since the panels are broken in 2 weeks (approx.)

Maybe buying new panels from Japan direcly would be a nice idea.

What is the current condition of the dedicabs in all US?

no problems with some hardware components?

maybe some production issues for the panels?

F*** Betson.

So what? In the end, if they're buying sn2 it's because they haven't taken the time to find out about the game. No unlocks, no eamuse, bad repair reputation, anyone who gets SN2 at this point really gets what they deserve. As I said in another thread, arcades have always been a bubblegum/ducttape operation even when stuff was new.

I'm surprized you haven't been complaining about the tube between the pads and cab being whimpy & fragile & nothing anywhere near what electrical conduit should really be housed in. That breaks within the first few weeks too, and they always have, for every ddr mix ever. Why not complain about that?

Because having those wires show, or having aracdes use like makeshift ducttape/piping solutions to repair it, doesn't impact my ability to play the game, and never has, despite it being a recurring problem in every cabinet.

Crappy sensors from the start, do.

moose: So what? In the end, if they're buying sn2 it's because they haven't taken the time to find out about the game. No unlocks, no eamuse, bad repair reputation, anyone who gets SN2 at this point really gets what they deserve.

So what you're saying is that a company is justified in putting out a piece of crap because in a few months, such subpar service will be considered acceptable?

moose: I'm surprized you haven't been complaining about the tube between the pads and cab being whimpy & fragile & nothing anywhere near what electrical conduit should really be housed in. That breaks within the first few weeks too, and they always have, for every ddr mix ever. Why not complain about that?

I have yet to see one of those tubes more than slightly damaged, let alone completely broken. Do the people in your arcade stomp on those things as a ritual between games or what?

I'm not saying it's justified, I'm just saying in the end it's the responsibility of the arcade to keep their games working. If they had full on pump grade sensors from the start, they'd eventually wear out and then where would you be?

It is also the responsibility of the operator to do research before purchasing a game. I've seen many a case of "why isn't this earning money?!" or "Why did this break?!" But I tend to notice a lot of them don't actually care to read the instruction manual for their machine or set it up properly anyway.

I'm not saying it's justified, I'm just saying in the end it's the responsibility of the arcade to keep their games working. If they had full on pump grade sensors from the start, they'd eventually wear out and then where would you be?

A lot further into the cabinet's lifespan where the wear-out of sensors is acceptable.

Things wear out and break, nobody's expecting a cabinet to withstand the test of time without having a little maintenance on it every now and then. But I've been playing since 1st mix, and never have I seen so many cabinets break down so quickly, and all with the same problem. Nevermind that they're all incidentally "brand-new" SN2 cabinets. Like I said before, even the SN1 cabinets weren't in nearly as bad condition, as all 5 of the ones in my area are still working perfectly fine with the occasional blip here and there that you expect with wear & tear. So Betson's obviously degraded the build of the cabinets AGAIN to save themselves more money this time around, and we're hurting as a result. Just another way that they've dropped the ball being Konami's NA distributor.

This is the point of this thread, not about who buys it and what they do with it, in "well, arcade ops should do research before buying". This thread isn't about who buys it, it's about the company that makes and distributes it.

If it wasn't the sensors then you'd be complaining that they didn't put Eamuse out (fast enough?). If it's not that then you complain about the charts or the sync or the round screws or something else.

Why don't you go make your own cabs that are 100% perfect and will please everyone across the whole world forever all at once and will never break and never need maintenance or new parts or anything?

Also because of Betson other **** sucks so just drop them the end.

Uh....I've NEVER complained about charts, sync, screws, brackets, or anything of the sort, ever.

I think you're probably runnning out of ways to be devil's advocate, so you're starting to make stuff up.

Everyone's been talking about sensors......

TGLMaxX: I think you're probably runnning out of ways to be devil's advocate, so you're starting to make stuff up.

I thought that already happened several posts ago.  I've never heard of anyone trying to use the cable tube as a reason to start an argument.